Donating = Loving
Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
Log in or create an account to join the discussions on the Atheist Republic forums.
Donating = Loving
Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
Donating = Loving
Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
FREE E-BOOKS
Get the book "Why There Is No God" and one more book for FREE!
Sign up below for the Atheist Republic Newsletter to get the books.
Record Your Message!
Record your voice here for it to be aired on the Atheist Republic Voicemails Podcast.
Send us your views and opinions, your personal stories, messages of support, comments on recent news, or any comments you would like to share about your part of the world.
Note : By clicking record you are allowing us to broadcast your message on any of our platforms.
Affiliate Disclaimer
Links to atheist related books, shirts and movies and other atheism related products are affiliate links.
All proceeds will go to keeping the Atheist Republic website up and running; providing resources, advocacy, community tools and encouragement to atheists all over the world.
Hanni, you quoted and wrote, “ ''Why are you here, Hanni, posting at AR? Are you on a mission? Looking for entertainment? Trying to hone debate skills? Assuage boredom?''
Right....oh no, I'm such a monster who tortures rational people by trying to have rational debates with them! How dare I? @@“
Are you intimating that the question of mine you quoted implies I think you’re a torturing monster?
Someone who finds amusement in the emotional distress of others can be count as a torturing monster.
Another common thing torturing monsters do is projecting and assume others are like them too.
Think about it.
@hanni the witch
Another thing they do is repeat themselves ad nauseam even after being demonstrated over and over and over, to be WRONG.
Haha good one, and did you know they also talk to themselves?
@Hanni! There is little to nothing you have said that is Rational; based on or in accordance with reason or logic. You have consistently been shown the errors in your assumptions and still you persist. Nothing logical or Rational about that at all. The sign of an idiot is someone who keeps doing the same thing over and over and over while expecting a different result. How long you gonna keep doing this?
Apparently, you define ''rational'' as being in accordance with your worldview. So anyone disagreeing with your worldview is irrational by default.
And ironically, your accusations of me are EXACTLY what people on this site are doing to me. Just look at Sheldon, for fuck's sake. The Projection Effect at its finest.
@Hanni the Witch Plays the Victim Card!!!
BAD SHELDON!! - YOU UNCARING, COLD HEARTED, PIECE OF EXCREMENT.
Cyber ...
Agree. No harm - self improvement - no problem.
It’s like an alcoholic goes to AA and gets sober and stays that way (not all stay sober; not all need AA, but you get the idea)...it works for them.
Could get into an argument about “the higher power aspect” of AA - but if it’s a need, a tool to help - I ain’t fuckin going to try to pull it away :)
Hanni expressed a positive emotional/mind result from her practise. We are living through a historic pandemic and self-isolating...plus other life factors
@Hanni - if you want to discuss your practises, advice, spells - start a thread in the “non debate” area of the forum.
It’s a safe space :)
Edit: ugh ...only for atheists- our safe space to escape theist assumptions. Are you a member on any Wiccan forums?
@White
"(not all stay sober; not all need AA, but you get the idea)...it works for them."
You have a flair for understatement . Alcoholics Anonymous has a success rate of around 3% ( success here is defined by staying sober for 2 year or more)
I recommend AA because there really isn't anything else. Few doctors or psychiatrists know much about the nature or biochemistry of addiction. Most [often expensive] rehab programmes for alcohol or drugs are based on the deeply flawed AA 12 step programme.
Most people get some immediate relief because they tend to be sober ----being sober at AA meetings is not mandatory, although you may not actually drink at a meeting .AA has ONE criteria for membership; the desire to stop drinking .
))))))))))))))))))0))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Oh, I noticed you have given up on the sad little witch,. Me too, firts post was pretty weird, then she tried to blame a member for her for her suicidal ideation.THAT's way out of my wheel house. Can't help and won't wear that shit.
----Being a Wiccan is a bit of a turn off for me. It's a religion invented in the 1950's by a retired British civil servant called Gerald Gardener. Much of it is supposedly based on Druidic practices. This pretty interesting seeing that the druids left no written records of any kind. That which was written was recorded by enemies, so cannot be trusted to be objective. In short, Wicca is woo of the first water.
I had a bit to with Wicca and a coven in the 1970's. I finally concluded that most of them were a few sandwiches short of a picnic, but harmless. This new one has that air about her. I certainly get the impression she's not entirely 'present'.
OF COURSE I could be totally wrong, and just a bigoted told fart . That's too bad ,I'm still going to ignore her posts.
Hey Cranky the Chef.... :)
I have no experience with AA, just the tv/movie version - went off that ... and haven’t ever “read further” ie success rate.
My journey into Wicca was a drive to explore pagan - with JW, all things are pagan and adopted into religions (ie Xmas) ... so .... :)
Oh dear. so you've lied again, as there is your claim from your OP misrepresenting the definition of atheism. This is bizarre stuff from you I must say.
Are you saying non real things are physical? It's hardly my fault you define your deity in a way that is synonymous with non existent things. It's also a question, not an argument, if you read it slowly you will notice the question mark at the end see. I've emboldened it for you. Any chance of an answer? A begging the question fallacy is where one creates an argument then makes assumptions about the very thing they are arguing for in the argument, I was asking a question not making an argument, and I made no assumptions at all, you were the one who claimed your deity was not physical. So no I have not used a begging the question fallacy,
By accusing me of lying (which I'm actually very incapable of doing, and absolutely did NOT do on the site), you're ironically exposing your own inability to comprehend the most, most basic logic.
I'm not arguing against the dictionary's definition of atheism.
I do argue that atheism disproportionately favors the physical.
How are the two in conflict with each other???
And I'm definitely not saying non-real things are physical, I'm saying that non-physical things are real.
You've flat out ignore my arguments, and kept repeating the ''where's the 'objective' evidence?'' rhetoric, which is an argument based on the assumption that only physical evidence counts, and thus non-physical things are not real by default (which you denied earlier, but fortunately I exposed your lie with solid logic).
And do need you to be so daft? When you ask rhetorical questions I treat them as arguments on their own because I literally have no other choice. What do you expect me to do, bark like a trained animal? Is that what you do when you rehearse your arguments at home, assuming your opponents are like trained animals? Well if you do I'm not surprised because you're undeniably a smart-ass and that's what smart-asses do. Too bad for you :p
dear oh dear...
Sigh, because atheism doesn't favour anything, it is defined as the lack or absence of belief in any deity or deities, and NOTHING MORE
Here is the dictionary definition again then:
Atheism
noun
1. disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.
Yes repeatedly, but refuse to say how you know, or demonstrate any objective evidence. You just keep ranting there isn't any, not very compelling really, and you lied about the two quotes from me, and made them up yourself dear, the regular posters here will know that I did not make them, but by all means post a link to the post of mine they are from. If you think telling blatant lies won't be spotted then you you are wrong, the regulars have a very good understanding of each others ideas, and would know I am very careful never to make absolute claims like the ones you made up and lied were from me.
Oh dear..liar liar pants on fire seems the only apropos response..
Know once again, can you demonstrate any objective evidence for any deity? If not then how do you claim to know any deity is real?
I seriously can't fathom how daft you are. You just dismissed what I said then repeated what you said, for like, the thousandth time.
Now, let me dumb it down for you to understand: why aren't these two (1. I'm not arguing against the dictionary 2. I argue that atheism favors the physical) in conflict??
Because they're not related with each other!
And my second points has been thoroughly demonstrated by your own very words. You literally show how physical you are then immediately deny the fact you're physical in the next paragraph.
Is it so hard for you to not be a troll?
''Yes repeatedly, but refuse to say how you know, or demonstrate any objective evidence. You just keep ranting there isn't any, not very compelling really, and you lied about the two quotes from me, and made them up yourself dear, the regular posters here will know that I did not make them, but by all means post a link to the post of mine they are from. If you think telling blatant lies won't be spotted then you you are wrong, the regulars have a very good understanding of each others ideas, and would know I am very careful never to make absolute claims like the ones you made up and lied were from me.''
I literally don't know what to say anymore. Since you're such a repetitive pathological liar (for any readers coming across this: go check out his previous conversations with me and you'll see what I mean), I shall be a repetitive pathological truth-teller, to balance it out!
So what's the truth? Well the truth is you're a liar. And I don't even usually call people liars even if they do lie, so you're like, a super exception, get it? Happy?
Also, as to the last part, I LITERALLY just showed you--with solid, basic formal logic--that you LIED.
I have nothing more to prove and shall continue to spread awareness of your blatantly repugnant character, until you move beyond this toxic bullshit once and for all.
Of course your claim about atheism is directly contradicted by the dictionary definition. Who knows why you think you can lie and misrepresent atheism and how it is defined, but hey ho.
Well then since you have chosen again to lie, I will post your lie here again then for all to see, with the link to your post in which you lied that I had made the two claims shown. Again all the regulars here will know me, and know I am always very careful not to make absolute claims of that nature.
You ignored my question again...
Know once again, can you demonstrate any objective evidence for any deity? If not then how do you claim to know any deity is real?
@hanni the witch: NOW YOUR POSTS ARE JUST SOUNDING STUPID.
RE: I'm not arguing against the dictionary's definition of atheism.
I do argue that atheism disproportionately favors the physical.
THEN YOU ARE ARGUING ABOUT THE DEFINITION OF ATHEISM!!! WAKE THE FUCK UP!!! ATHEISM HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SCIENCE!!!
Atheism is a response to the idea that Gods exist. ATHEIST: A person who does not believe in God or gods.... THAT'S IT.....;;PERIOD..... NOTHING MORE..... STOP ADDING SHIT TO ATHEISM/
RE: I'm saying that non-physical things are real. (AND ALL WE WANT TO KNOW IS HOW IN THE FUCK YOU ARE GOING TO PROVE THAT!) If it is non-physical and has no effect on the physical world. IT IS USELESS and there is no reason to believe it exists. If it has an effect on the physical world, THAT EFFECT IS MEASURABLE. Which is it?
@hanni the witch
I made no mention of "mind body problem" that was you, again since you didn't even bother to explain what it means, or therefore what possible relevance it had to my question to you, that you have again ignored, it was by definition a non sequitur that you used to ignore that question. Your insertion of Sam Harris was an even more bizarre non sequitur, and your excuse I might be about to mention him is quite possibly the most absurdly dishonest thing you've posted.
Again I ask what evidence can you demonstrate that the human brain requires anything beyond the physical?
Please stop lying and evading, this is a question and assumes nothing.
Well for those with the most basic reading and language comprehension skills, it is because I never said it was exclusively a physical phenomenon, ad because i made no mention whatsoever of "the spiritual", and of course because dyspite your dishonest paraphrasing it was part of a fucking question, not an assertion. But it is becoming increasingly obvious you either do not possess such basic skills, or are a lying troll. As for avoiding questions, your lying rant never answered mine, and your questions are straw man fallacies asking me to justify claims I have not made, or assigning such claims in a generic fashion to atheism, which itself neither makes nor implies any claims.
I guess we will never know, as you seem unable to present anything, and sulk like a stroppy teenager when asked.
Why do you believe a deity exists? It's a simply enough question.
Ah, you're trolling I thought as much, everyone here is fairly familiar with my posts, and will know those are two lies you have made up dear. I'll play along, care to link the posts where you claim I made those claims?
Oh no, this is very disconcerting, as I do like to stay on good terms with barking mad theist trolls when they breeze through here.
Get out much do you?
You are literally ignoring everything I say and repeating what you said earlier. Blatant denial. Have you ever heard of the personal incredulity fallacy? Yes, you have, I presume? Well then take a deep look in the mirror, why don't you?
I've already listed spiritual/emotional evidence in another comment, that one about social anxiety and gender dysphoria. But I don't like to repeat myself (unlike you), so since you're so serious why don't you go check it out. What I said was nowhere near comprehensive, so feel free to demand more.
Tell you what, so far you have NOT successfully made a single convincing case, I literally feel like talking to a brick wall. I think I've already said enough about how repetitive and dishonest you are.
And I'm making it clear that I ASSURE you, with 999% certainty, and I swear to fucking whatever existent gods and goddesses, that I'm absolutely HONEST. If I'm not, let the lightning strike me, let everyone on this site choke me to death and eat my guts out, and let my body be thrown off a cliff to be eaten be wolves and NEVER TO BE FOUND!!!!!!!!
Is this exactly what you were looking for? Emotional distress from your opponent? Oh, now I get it. Anyways you made it. you MADE IT. You've WON.
SIKES, just kidding. You really think this is going to win a debate?! Are you so blissful to the extent of thinking you've actually made a case for atheism with superior logic and reasoning? You actually think you're doing a favor for atheism?
Wow.
No, I have heard of an argument from incredulity fallacy, it's a favourite with creationists on here.
Link it please, as I am dubious given your proven and relentless mendacity thus far.
Liar you made up two lies and assigned them to me here:
I've provided a link so everyone can go to your posts and see your lie, as neither of those claims were ever made by me. I have asked you to link the posts you claim they came from, of course you can't because I never made those claims, nor would I, as most regular posters here will undoubtedly know I am very careful not to make absolute claims like those.
You're the one who is obsessed with winning here, not me, I haven't ever mentioned it. However since this debate forum is in an atheist site, I'd be surprised of your woo woo superstitious rhetoric got many agrees, especially given how bizarre and incomprehensible most of your verbiage is.
Atheism doesn't make a case, it is not a claim, nor a belief. You are the one who has come here to peddle your superstitious wares, so it is you who has to make a case for them.
So if you can't demonstrate any objective evidence for your deity, then how do you claim to know it is real? If you're going to claim this is in another post then please link it, as I am not going to scour 4 pages of your vapid verbiage for it.
Seriously? You think I have the right mind to carefully find the right page for you? Since you're so serious, why don't you check out yourself?
And as to the two ''lies'', I swear it my guts that I'm absolutely honest. You've literally repeatedly said you only want physical evidence, for like a million times, and you've literally said that non-physical things are not real.
And if you're know ANYTHING about formal logic, you'd guess what's the conclusion! Oh I forgot, you've already denied you ever made those claims. Oh, silly me! :P
''You're the one who is obsessed with winning here, not me,''
ME, obsessed with ''WINNING''? No, for fucks sake, I'm obsessed with what's wrong and what's right, and you being a repetitive pathological liar leaves me NO choice but to hunt you down, because if I leave out of frustration, then apparently YOU'd ''win'', which is an outcome I morally cannot tolerate.
''However since this debate forum is in an atheist site, I'd be surprised of your woo woo superstitious rhetoric got many agrees, especially given how bizarre and incomprehensible most of your verbiage is.''
Oh wow, you actually know sarcasm? I got many agrees? Oh, hahaha, nice, you literally made me laugh.
Ok now, seriously? I never even said anything about quantum vibrators and shit, and now you're accusing me of woo-woo?
Who's incomprehensible here?!
''Atheism doesn't make a case, it is not a claim, nor a belief. ''
You have already literally made like, a FUCKTON of claims, and now you expect me to believe you don't make claims?? How can you say that the liar is me instead of you, without being FUCKING ASHAMED of everything you are?
Oh, maybe it's because you're incapable of feeling remorse, and that's in your genes. Oh, OH I'M SORRY for daring to refuse to suck a psycopath's dick, geez what a monster AM I!
''You are the one who has come here to peddle your superstitious wares, so it is you who has to make a case for them.''
I literally did, and you keep IGNORING them!
''So if you can't demonstrate any objective evidence for your deity, then how do you claim to know it is real?''
The problem is, why don't you accept subjective evidence?!
talk about the pot calling the kettle black, now that's an irony overload.
Why do you believe a deity is real? I'll just keep asking...
Belief in deities is justified because the spiritual exists, and there are presumably governing spiritual laws/agents.
What's so ironic about a theist that happens to be not part of an organized religion? Do you seriously think theists are all the same?
Not sure who this was aimed at...
Argument from assertion fallacy, again.
How do you know any deity is real if you can demonstrate no evidence for the claim?
No, YOU are guilty of the assertion fallacy because you assert there's no spiritual realm.
And once again, how do you know the Indian Ocean exists if you can't build a rocket?
Another lie, I have never asserted this. merely asked you to evidence your claim.
Because there is sufficient objective evidence. Of course you could just try Google earth...
What do you have comparable to that to evidence your deity?
I'm still waiting for you to justify your dismissal of the spiritual.
I made this Indian Ocean analogy to show how unsubstantiated your demand is, which exposes your bias. Non-physicals fall outside the realm of the physicals, just like how the existence of the Indian Ocean fall outside the realm of whether you could build a rocket.
Because I can dip my toes in it? Sheesh. It is right where I live.
@posters
I’m not going to engage the Hanni the witch
These are my personal reasons based on her posts:
Mental health issue; life changing acceptance (?) of who she is; anger issues with past religion tied to her view of “atheism”
I’m not sure what is suppose to be provided here as far as “debate” and I can’t censor myself in an effort to save “her hurt feelings” when challenged.
Assessing my comfort level, I can only ethically engage someone who I feel “can handle it emotionally”...
My advice to Hanni ...find a Wiccan forum and engage those who support your worldview. If you are truly on a spiritual journey, you do not need to add more conflict in your mind than what you have claimed you have already experienced.
Signing off - have fun and remember “you get what you give” ...if you don’t like what you are reading Hanni - take a close look at what you are writing.
@Whitefire13
You make a salient point, I think I will take a break now as well.
Lots of luck to anyone else who tries..
You are not getting out of this.
Pages