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Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
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An eternal cookie? Brilliant! We really have to get a team of engineers on this pronto - I would love an eternal cookie. Perhaps an oreo... or chocolate chip... oatmeal raisin? Too many options, I guess I'll preserve my spectrum of choices by settling for temporary cookies that I can enjoy periodically.
That's kind of the way I feel about heaven and hell, also. Religion tells me that I have to pick one or the other, but I like the variety of life as it has the potential to be here on earth. I don't really believe in heaven or hell, since, by virtue of individual choice, one person's heaven is another's hell anyway.
I think the concept of heaven and hell are in one's own mind. Everyone's perception of each is different and even though it's not real, it might be where your mind rests just before it finally ceases to be.
I had what was called an outer-body experience at one point when a person tried to poison me. Being who I am I used to fight a lot real fights not the the verbal kind and I have been knocked out a time or two. I know the feeling I have seen the caused by being knocked out. when I was poisoned I guess it could have all been a hallucination but even if it was it has had significant impact on my point of view.
At first I was alone, the immense pain I was in was gone and I was in a dark place like a tunnel but with no walls, ground or ceiling just an incredible darkness and there was a lighter area as if some far off source of light and I went towards this light as if by conscious choice when I got there that was all it was the opposite of where I had just been so I kept going into it eventually I saw darkness emerge as if it were light all over again so I ventured into darkness deep into it like I had been in the light. The time I spent here felt like an eternity and my mind was so clear all my thoughts were readily available it was a trip one could say. But being in darkness again I asked the question where am I and I was immediate answered and saw myself form about 12 feet above laying on the rock next to the bikepath where I was before I was in the darkness. My immediate reaction was "hell no" and I repossessed my body. Yes that means I got back in my body. I was cold, stiff and there and the immense pain returned. slowly I came back fighting for my life I even asked a passerby for help and he just walked away. For months after this I thought about life and death in ways I never had before that in my life. It is one thing to hear accounts of something like this but its another thing to live it. I figure the time I was out of my body must have been short but it felt much longer. I was surprised to find my self laying there but not just because I was not in my body but especially since it felt I had traveled a long way.
I have gone to and asked religious figureheads priest preachers ect.. about my experience to see what they say and they say my experience sounds like limbo or that God did not feel I was ready to die they all have some sort of answer. Personally I don't think I knew what was happening I felt like energy and I wonder what else I could have done there but honestly it seemed like I was alone alone with my mind and things were just very accessible as soon as I asked where I was I immediately saw my self. I really wonder what else I could have done there. I wonder if that was all it was I wonder if I could have conjured anything I thought about there that seemed to be the theme to me. I think if i believed I was going to heaven I would have found it there I think I could have found hell there to but it would I believe been my interpretations of them rather than some actual place. I did not spend much time contemplating my life but I am sure if i did, I just get this feeling it would have all been there for me to witness, in a way I think my thoughts were so vivid there I can imagine it would be easy to go over ones life there and if someone did that I can imagine they could easily be happy or sad about the life they lived. but everything felt like an eternity there just saying I think someone could create their own heaven or hell. Just my own experience and I can't even say though it felt very real that this really happened. It could have just been some sort of dream state I was in while being poisoned. By the way the person I later found out poisoned me because he thought I had stolen something that belonged to his brother but in reality his brother had come and gotten it that day before we went to his house.
this all reminds me of one of my favorite religious based stories,
There was this guy who died and he found himself walking along a dirt road with his dog that had been dead for years it was a beautiful day everything seems just nice. As he was walking along he happened along this big pearly gate with golden pavers and all sorts of other amazing and beautiful things on the other side standing at this gate was a man. The man told him he was welcome to come in and that this place was heaven but when he tried to enter he was told sorry but dogs are not allowed here, well the guy was saddened by this and just simply had to leave because he could not leave his best friend behind. So after a while walking down the road he came upon a ranch and on this ranch he found a rancher and his wife, being thirtsy he asked the rancher if there was a place to get some water the rancher started to laugh and replied "Sure right up on that hill there is a fountain take all the water you want" being burned at the last place the guy asked if his dog could have some water too? and the rancher replied "Of course, there is a faucet with a bowl there so both you and dog could have water all the water you want". the man said "Thanks but I have to ask about that place down the road the man there said it was Heaven. The ranchers wife interjected "Oh you found that place, Some trick they got going on there, that's really Hell apparently someone thought it would be a good idea to weed out the good from the bad people by seeing if they would be willing to leave their best friends behind.
Nope.
Yep. pretty much.
Not exactly heaven and hell, but I believe that people will go somewhere after death based on how they have lived their lives on earth. There is God that will reward or punish in the end, just like saying you will reap what you sow.
Atheists doesn't believe in god who will punish us in the afterlife so it is more important for them to live their life to the fullest without worrying about the afterlife. While I don't care if there's afterlife or not, I'm also intrigue about it but right now I'm living my life to its fullest too.
As a Christian, I do believe both. I believe that as humans, we contain a little piece of God in all of us; this is what makes us human. I believe, as God is abstract (without physical being), that Heaven is literally God's mind. I believe that our souls (the part of God that is in all of us) return to his mind when we die, and he gives us our paradise. Hell, even though it exists, is not a place for humans. It is not within Gods mind, but exists outside of it and wholly apart from God, meaning God does not exist here. This is for Satan and his minions only. Humans have not, are not, and will not go here.
First you have to realize that the concept that all "good" people go to heaven and all "bad" people go to hell isn't a Bible teaching, its a teaching that was adopted by the apostate church. The Bible teaches that the meek shall inherit the earth and live forever upon it, and a few will go to heaven to rule and judge with Christ Jesus. It teaches that heaven was created for God and his angels and Earth was created for man.
The meek are contesting the will.
Naturally many will contest, as was expected, but the distinction within the application may be slightly off. Of course, this was also expected of those distinctly opposed in a far less obvious disposition. The Bible put it this way:
"And I have hope toward God, which hope these [men] themselves also entertain, that there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous." (Acts 25:14)
"Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will." (Matthew 7:21)
To be honest I didn't read all the responses on this thread... But I'm totally into the idea that Heaven and Hell are states of consciousness you can experience or create for yourself.. and regardless of your belief or non-belief.. if everyone on this planet worked together in co-existence, Heaven really could take place on Earth! God Damn It haha, religion should be about self-sacrifice in the sense that you crucify your ego and allow yourself to be unconditionally loving towards others regardless of who they are, like Christ did, awaken to the reality we are all in fact interconnected and living as ONE creation, on ONE planet, and that taking care of one another and sharing the experience of Love together in this miraculous nature of our existence is more important then petty ego-driven greed, self-importance and apathy...
I mean, it is just the hippy dream, but I think all religions began with this vision of a Utopia... and no offence to Atheists, because religious fundamentalists can be incredibly judgemental and hateful, but I don't think the T-shirt Advertisements on this website are really promoting Co-Existence... which is personally my only mission as a human being temporarily existing on this little blue marble... Call me a Christian or Mystic or whatever, but my only goal is to bring more Unconditional Love and Light into this world..
Just my crazy rant for the day =)
JahLive,
In a sense I agree with your hippy dream, but at the same time that that is what we should strive for in this imperfect system or world, we also have to keep in mind it will always fail ultimately. We should respect and be tolerant of other people's culture and beliefs, no doubt.
http://www.pathwaymachine.com/music/raggae.pls
PS: I thought the T shirts were creative and a good way to publicly express their beliefs, as well as support the forums. I wasn't offended by any of them.
I had troubles accessing your link.. are you a musician? I would like to hear..
And yeah, I mean, freedom of expression and speech in this beautiful country is something to be cherished, so criticize religion as much as possible please! religion needs criticism haha I just come here to rant and share ideas =)
I need to work on my website again once I graduate but here it is too if you are also curious... www.curtismusicart.com
Sorry about that link, its okay but you would have to have downloaded Winamp or Real Player. Its a Raggae radio station from my site.
Nice website you have. Keep up the good work.
If you believe in a heaven / hell, there is really easy to change logic of your view.
Beneath the surface there is ground, and beneath the ground there is the core piece of the earth, which keeps everything together.
Above the earth there is stars, planets, galaxies, black holes, etc..
If you rethink it with this in mind, the answer is simple. No there is no heaven / hell
According to the Bible the heavens is where the birds fly, where the clouds are. Hell is the grave. Are these things not real? What religion says these things are is another matter.
Think of your life as a light bulb. A light bulb starts great, but its get weaker and weaker over the bulbs "age".
This is how we work aswell, we are energy aswell, just like the light bulb. We start great, and over the years we age and in the end our energy runs out. You will not go anywhere after you run out of juice. Your mind will collapse, your organs will start failing, your heart will stop pumping. Your soul will not go anywhere, because you simply dont have a soul to begin with.
Schibaka, the Bible pretty much agrees with all that you said in the above post.
At the bottom of his heart, Jesus was a good man, he just wanted you all to think reasonbly in this world. And he chose the method he thought was best to win you over to his side, by trolling you all into believing in something that didnt exist.
The concept of a Hell existing as a place to condemn humans is logically and philosophically against God's very nature.
Now, before I explain myself, let me extrapolate a bit. The idea of a Hell existing is not against God's nature, but the idea of Hell existing *as a place to condemn humans* is against God's nature. Now we can examine why.
Hell is a place, in the Christian religion, where those who have sinned and not accepted Christ go to suffer an eternity of anguish, pain, torture, and suffering. Now, Hell--as it is originally described--is not a place where there's fire and brimstone and people cooking in pots, as one might see. Hell is defined differently from the lake of fire, it is defined as a place of extreme torment and suffering, on a scale literally incomprehensible by humans.
God, in order to be God, must be omniscient; that is, He knows anything and everything, and omnibeneolent; that is, he is a wholly good being. Any act He does is morally good is some way or another. Now, if God does exist, then He possesses these traits. If He possesses these traits, then He cannot condemn a human to Hell and still be considered God. Here's why: If God is to be omniscient then He is to be absolutely open-minded, rational, understanding, and logical. If He condemns a human to Hell for an eternity of suffering for only a temporary sin (and even if you're not there for an eternity) then God cannot be omniscient and therefore is not God. To condemn a human to an *eternity* of suffering in Hell for a *temporary* sin is malevolent, ignorant, and extremely narrow-minded. If this is true, then God would not be omniscient or omnibenevolent, and therefore would not be God.
If God is omniscient, then He must know that we are going to sin, and that we're sinful creatures. To then condemn us to Hell is extremely ignorant and narrow-minded of God (this is akin to killing a dog for eating a steak *you* put in its bowl). He, then, would not be omniscient and therefore would not be God.
This, theologically and philosophically, vitiates the idea of a Hell, at least as a place where humans are condemned. Hell is not a place for us, it is a place for Satan and his minions to dwell away from God. Nobody should ever fear Hell, for God understands, and does not wish to condemn you to an eternity of suffering.
Hey Smack of God, I have been enjoying reading your perspective on things but wish at this point to make one thing clear to you, God according to YOUR PERSPECTIVE* must be these things you speak of.
*Your perspective means a perspective that is yours and not necessarily the view of others.
That being said I really have been enjoying the reading and learning of your perspective. I agree with some of your ways of logic though I feel you do make some logical leaps from time to time.
*I was going to fix Smack of God but thought it funnier to leave it the way it was and put in this note.
My perspective is based off of a theological and philosophical view of God. God must possess these traits for if He does not, He cannot be God.
Lets rephrase that a little.
Your perspective is based of your interpretation of a theological and philosophical view of God! A god must possess these traits for if this god does not, this god can not be the god you call God!
Think about what I said here, realize that its actually the same thing you said, consider what site you are on, and think about how when put the way I said it, it could be better received. you are not the first theist to come join discussions on this site. Pay some mind to who you're talking with and who this place was made for and I think you can fit in just fine with discussion. I get it you have your beliefs and they are important to you but what other people believe or don't believe can be just as if not more important to them.
I actually like reading what you have to put out here, I'm just trying to help you be better received.
God knows everything ? I guess you know everything, because you created the "God" in your mind. Please if you're gona rant about God, find a jesus site or some shit. Its tirefull to read all this crap at once
Then don't read it and your problem shall be solved. Nobody forced you to read my post. I didn't create God, God created me. It seems you have a very poor understanding of the Christian religion, my friend.
I would argue that while you do have a better understanding of Christianity than most Christians you would you like it if atheist went into your church and put went around talking about their non-belief and took up all your time with it? would you like it if they kept telling you that man created god and wrote it on your church forum? Be careful how you answer because Jesus said what so ever you do to the least of his people so you did onto he. By not being aware of your actions and treating people in a way you would not like to be treated you have broken JCs' version the Golden Rule!
By the way, Christ is a name Jesus did not want called unto he. Unfortunately most atheist are inundated with Christian education to a point no normal person would willingly subject themselves to and most atheist have a better understanding of Christianity than most Christians do.
no
Nope, I don't. Ever since I was... who knows what age, I was agnostic, until I was 14/15 - I became an atheist..
But when I was 8, my class got told that we'd go to hell for being bad, so i was only scared of fire.......
Nope, I don't. Ever since I was... who knows what age, I was agnostic, until I was 14/15 - I became an atheist..
But when I was 8, my class got told that we'd go to hell for being bad, so i was only scared of fire.......
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