@Leper

we're you one those who openly admit that I might be right?

Give me solid testable repeatable evidence of a claim of yours, and I will be happy to admit you are right if the evidence holds up and is true. I also say this to any theist: if you can prove to me with large amounts of real evidence that your particular god idea is real, not only would i HAPPILY say you were right all along, but I would kiss your feet for enlightening me and happily give you all my worldly possessions if you desired it. I would very likely still think whatever god that was is evil/horrible, but I would be eternally very thankful for the very important information that a particular god was actually real.

You're one of those doubtful atheists?

Definitely not. I put the likelihood of any of the major religion/god concepts I have ever heard of actually being real at about the same likelihood that the sun will rise from the west tomorrow instead of the east.

Or is it that the moral standards you want to apply to me are different from those you follow yourself?

I would be thrilled if you and others followed my personal moral code instead of that of a pedophile supposed divine prophet person that died over 1000 years ago. But I do not expect that, I do encourage all people to drop all these unevidenced bronze age superstitions as I feel the whole of humanity would benefit rather enormously. For one we would not likely have to argue over if marrying a 6 year old and getting her pregnant before 10 is actually "okay."

Not at all, the Qur'an is right with this, if you've read it.

I fully admit I have not read the Qur'an, only small quotes/snippets here and there. I have no interest in reading it beyond pointing out where it badly contradicts it self or is openly false and/or vague. I have read enough of it and heard enough about it to know exactly what it is, a highly edited, translated work written over 1000 years ago by people that most certainly had an agenda.

however the actual word in the original version doesn't have to be translated as "a day".

This further highlights the problem of highly edited translated works written over 1000 years ago. The whole day thing in genesis is rather comical. How did they mistranslate a DAY? A simple concept that every single human well understands? Did the translators (done in house by the religion!) just decide to deceive people for a while with ridiculous notion of 6 days of creation, of which several was before the sun was even created?

Well in Islam Muhammad was the last prophet.

Glad we agree.

Here, its funny, atheists often like to point out that theists put human characteristics on God, but that's exactly what you do and that's partly why - or at least how - you reject God. You think it absurd God would wait because...... You think that if you had magical powers you wouldn't have patience.

You forget, I do not believe in any god of anytype, at all. I assign no human characteristics to a god, because I very confidently believe there is no such thing. You are however correct on one of the reasons why I reject any and all god ideas, because just about all of the major god ideas, you responded to my thread about why all gods are illogical, you already know I think this. I actually was not talking about god's patience, I was talking about the ineptitude of god and how fleeting its supposed interaction with humans are. It is religion that assigns ALL KINDS OF human like behavior to god, most religions even point out something like: "god made man in his image" they openly admit to this! Religions anthropomorphizing god IS a major reason why I reject the god ideas. It is utterly illogical. And religion ideas are forced to anthropomorphize god, or it would not be a successful lasting religion. If 2000+ years ago when the religion was not yet popular they went around telling people: God is some entity that lives outside space and time and we cannot possibly understand it, but it created the universe, but has nothing like human or animal empathy (because it most certainly is not like any animal or human) because we don't even know what it is, and it does not interact with us humans in any meaningful way (like handing down a supposed guide/list to morals and rules) do you think anyone would follow that religion? Listen to the leaders of it? Donate power and money to it?

2 Peter 3:3.... etc

Why would I care about some quote from some book that is completely unevidenced and obviously is not based in anyway in reality? Sounds like a waste of time to me.

Time was created by God. He isn't bound by it which is again something you assume He is because you assume He is something like you when He is nothing like anyone or anything else.

This shows the very common, (even among atheist) misunderstanding what time actually is. But anyways despite that, we humans are certainly bound by time, even if this supposed god idea is not. Why would an entity outside of space time care one whit about humans? If this god concept is not human like and cannot be understood, how can we possibly have any sort of meaningful conversation about this god and how it could possibly relate to you and me? What /any action by this creator entity outside of space time have anything to do with you and me now? Essentially you are running to god of the gaps god concept, (a concept that is completely out of reach of anysort of rational discourse like being falsifiable,) then make an invisible zero connection leap from that god to your current god concept that is MUCH MUCH more than simply god of the gaps entity.

God didn't talk to them? The Qur'an says All people have been sent the message. Therefore, all people have been sent the message. How, by whom, when, what message, that no one knows.

I certainly did not receive that message. Most people I ever talked to have never received such a message. Either your god concept is utterly inept at communication (for being supposedly all powerful and knowing,) or only talks to a select few people, (what an asshole if that god also rewards/punish based on complicity to his message.) OR ya know the far and away most reasonable simple and likely scenario: your god concept is just that, a concept, completly unmoored by any sort of corroabtory actual evidence.

In Islam there is speculation - according a hadith - that there have been an approximate of 124,000 prophets and messengers.

124,000 prophets to 110+ billion people. Lets round down a bit to make the math easier. 110k prophets for 110 billion people. Thats 1 prophet per roughly 1 million people. And despite all these prophets adoption rate of islam as a whole is still below 10%. Another sign of how inept a god supposedly interested in communicating to people through prophets (why such a horribly inefficient way?? remember we are talking about a god that created everything including us humans!) Again we are left with eithir a highly inept god or one that at least is very duplicitous and selective (evil.)

Again you are assuming God should think like you.

I dont assume that at all, out of all the various god ideas out there, the one I think most likely is some sort of entity that is currently greater than humans that may have some sort of hand in the creation of life on earth, maybe the earth, maybe the universe. I think even this god is highly unlikely as evolution, chemistry, etc explains such things with far greater detail and actually has observable testable data to back it up. But gun to my head if I had to pick a god idea, that is the one I would pick as most likely. These assumptions about god of the major religions like christianity and islam comes from the books, the talk etc of the people that believe in that.

Same as before. Why should we live forever? That is your human greed speaking.

Same as before... what? I missed that memo. I never said we should live forever. I was talking about things like cancer. Is it greed to want humans to have been smartly enough "designed" by a supposed god entity that can design sharks to not have cancer? Is it really? What about little kids that die of horrible cancers before they even hit 5 years old? Going to leave that oversight of your god concepts all mighty powers to: "god works in mysterious ways?"

Do you mean the flood? In the Qur'an it is not a global flood.

This is why I did not say the words "flood" I have heard the Qur'an has its own versions of global catastrophe created by an (angry?) god.

LogicFTW: "Why is evolution not even vaguely mentioned in all the ancient text that supposedly came from god?"
Leper: It is in the Qur'an.

I know I can go look up the quotes my self, but I am interested (for once!) in which quotes you base this assumption from. Post them and I will gladly deconstruct that.

 
 

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